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How workforce mobility is redefining global business risks
In this episode of the Tax and Law in Focus podcast, speakers discuss workforce mobility, cross-border work, and strategies to manage risks and enhance employee experiences.
In this episode of theTax and Law in Focus podcast, host Susannah Streeter is joined by Maureen Flood, EY Global Mobility Reimagined Leader; Stephanie King, EY EMEIA People Advisory Services Tax Leader; and Ben Willis, EY EMEIA Immigration Leader. Together, they discuss the evolving nature of global workforce mobility, focusing on the challenges and opportunities of managing cross-border work in a post-pandemic world.
The conversation explores key findings from the EY 2024 Mobility Reimagined Survey, including the growing demand for flexible work and the corresponding rise in tax, immigration, and compliance risks. The panel examines how leading mobility functions are transforming their operating models to become strategic advisors to the business, leveraging technology and data to enhance compliance and improve employee experience. They also offer practical insights into mitigating risks, managing short-term business travel and the role of emerging technologies like AI in reshaping mobility programs.
Throughout the discussion, a human-centric approach to mobility is emphasized, highlighting the need to balance business goals with employee well-being in an increasingly complex regulatory environment.
Key takeaways:
Understand the evolving challenges of managing workforce mobility in a post-pandemic world, including cross-border tax, immigration, and compliance risks.
Learn how to adapt mobility functions to support flexible and hybrid work models while maintaining compliance and mitigating risk.
Explore strategies for transforming mobility functions into strategic advisors to the business by leveraging technology and data.
Gain insights into the importance of a human-centric approach to mobility, focusing on enhancing the employee experience.
Discover how organizations can future-proof their mobility models against anticipated changes in tax and immigration law.
For your convenience, full text transcript of this podcast is also available.
Susannah Streeter
Hello and welcome to the Tax and Law in Focus podcast. I'm Susannah Streeter. In this edition, we're going to focus on the dramatic changes taking place in workforce mobility, the challenges posed to cross-border work, and the crucial steps that organizations need to take to reduce risk. After the upheaval of the pandemic, there are fresh pressures facing employers, from geopolitical risk to labor constraints. For many knowledge workers, hybrid and flexible work is an expectation, and new technologies have allowed for a distributed workforce with high productivity and a positive work culture, so long as it's underpinned by trust. Beyond the technical and logistical challenges of cross-border work of any duration, organizations are facing an increasingly complex web of global tax, immigration, legal, and compliance risks. It doesn't help that mobility functions are left trying to fill the needs of this new landscape, often with antiquated structures and processes. So in this podcast, we're going to look at the challenges of this new era of a distributed workforce and highlight ways of managing risk, reimagining operating models, improving processes, but also prioritizing people's experiences. Now, it may sound like a tall order, but I am delighted to say I have a trio of subject matter experts[TG1] who can guide you through a roadmap of what needs to be done to ensure mobility models are fit for purpose in the new, more digital, integrated era.
They'll let us know what the most evolved mobility functions are doing to navigate the new world. But before I introduce them, please remember, conversations during this podcast should not be relied on as accounting legal investment nor other professional advice. Listeners must, of course, consult their own advisors.
Now, I'm very pleased to welcome, first of all, Maureen Flood, who is EY Global Mobility Reimagined Leader. Where are you today, Maureen? What's the weather like?
Maureen Flood
Susannah, I'm happy to join you today from sunny Florida in the US.
Streeter
Well, it's great to have you with us, bringing the sunshine. Also, let me welcome Steph King, who is EY EMEA People Advisory Services Tax Leader. Steph, where are you today?
Stephanie King
Hi Susannah. It's great to be here, and I'm in London.
Streeter Lovely to have you with us. Also, Ben Willis, EY EMEA Immigration Leader. Which part of the world are you in, Ben? I know you travel a lot.
Ben Willis
Surprisingly, I'm not in an airport today. I'm actually one of those flexible workers you just referred to. I'm working from home in the countryside of Kent, which is about an hour outside of London. It's sunny, by the way.
Streeter
Fantastic. Great to have you all with us today. I want to, first of all, in this podcast, set the scene and look at some really fascinating findings of the EY 2024 Mobility Reimagined Survey. Maureen, tell me, what does the survey show in respect to increased cross-border mobility risks given this upswing in remote work and increased travel.
Flood
Well, Susannah, when we conducted our research and really consistent with the client conversations that we continue to have, 87% of employees continue to tell us that they want flexibility, and 50% of employers want to see human interaction. In 2024, we're actually expected to return to pre-pandemic levels of business travel, and that recognizes the fact that we want to continue to have that interaction but work flexibly in how we have that interaction. The return to travel, the continued demand for hybrid ways of working mean that from a mobility lens, 66% of organizations think that the scope of mobility is changing. This isn't the siloed mobility function of the past. It's a function that's influencing core business and talent outcomes, given a seat at the table to really understand how people want to work and what the business needs to enable those people. That means that mobility can really be a strategic advisor. It also means that it's much more complex. It's not the traditional long-term assignments or permanent moves of the past. We now have all these different iterations of hybrid working, cross-order commuters, and that flexibility impacts mobility, it impacts the concerns around risk. So 71% of organizations tell us that they are more concerned than ever about risk. Part of that has to do with the fact that the data available to authorities, be it immigration, regulatory tax authorities, is more present than it ever was before with things like AI and technology. That access to information has hyper-accelerated, and we think that's going to continue. And that means that as scope increases, as risk increases, organizations have pressure from employees to have flexibility. The mobility function really is at a core place to really help influence the future of how businesses engage with their employees and how they work.
Streeter
Yeah, and so that's the situation now. But I mean, what's ahead in terms of the scope of mobility, are we going to see more of the same, a continued acceleration?
Flood
I think the hyper-acceleration and flexibility and the demand for flexibility, Susanna, is going to continue. This challenge is probably as small as it's ever been and changing as it's ever going to be in the future.
Streeter
So Ben, let me bring you in. Where do you think that companies are getting it wrong while attempting to deal with this new normal that Maureen's outlined there? Is there too much reliance on old mobility models when we're dealing with new trends in immigration and mobility? What effect does this have?
Willis
Yeah Susannah, I wouldn't say that companies are getting things wrong, per se. What I would say is that there are those companies out there, and typically they have sophisticated, more sophisticated programs, and they're able to react faster to the new norms. They're out there being proactive in establishing new governance mechanisms, making sure their team structures are adjusted, and looking at their mobility policies and processes to flex, and a lot of the time flex towards that employee experience, which is becoming all important. For those other companies who may not have that level of infrastructure, they may find it and are finding it more difficult to adapt to those changes and challenges. Without that flexibility, their policies and operating model and even their technology are not being able to scale up and down to manage that influx. It's really like a two-speed operation between those sophisticated programs and unsophisticated, so to speak.
Streeter
Okay, so we've got this two-speed situation, Steph, let me get your view. What new operating model then is required to meet all these changing needs of managing cross-jurisdictional tax risk and manage mobility, but at the same time, of course, prioritising people's experience?
King
Yeah, so I think Ben has actually alluded to this, that it will come as no surprise to hear there is no one-size-fits-all when it comes to an operating model for mobility. The choice of the operating model will depend on each company's specific needs, their objectives. There could also be sector-specific nuances to consider. Clearly, the volume of the global workforce that they are managing and the levels of mobility that they are dealing with will influence the type of operating model that they will have. What is clear is the topic of workforce mobility and the organization's ability to manage this is increasingly important, both for business success and as you've mentioned, the employee value proposition. We're seeing lots of review of functions and operating models, making sure that they are aligning to the business and talent strategies of organizations, be it centralised models, regional models with end market presence. We also see increasingly the businesses exploring outsourcing and using third-party providers. This is a very complex area in terms of dealing with cross-border tax risk and immigration risk. We see the rise of things like global employment organizations, but also, as I've mentioned, outsourcing for various components of mobility. I think, of course, the adoption of GenAI is going to have quite an impact on operating models going forward as well.
Streeter
Yeah, clearly, there's so much to consider. So Maureen, just how important is it that, in a way, you've got to take a step back and assess the scene before taking all those steps forward so that any new approach is considered in a way that really does prioritize people's experiences?
Flood
I think experiences really need to be at the centre and the heart of everything we think about when we think mobility. Sure, we need to make sure we're getting the business what they need, that we're managing risks. But at the end of the day, we're talking about humans, people, right? If their experiences are not positive, then all of the other things really don't come to fruition in helping us realize the true opportunity that mobility plays to help organizations really drive the business forward and drive the talent agenda forward. So to me, experience has to be at the center of everything we do.
Streeter
Ben, what do you think needs to be put in place to enable this strategic re-evaluation, particularly when it comes to retention? Can some models already being used be recalibrated, or should firms go right back to the drawing board?
Willis
When you mentioned drawing board, straight away I think of foundation, what do we need to build from? I've been iterating, reiterating, I should say, as I look internally within EY in[TG2] our program, how we manage things. I've been talking about the three T's, and I'm pretty sure my colleagues are calling me the guy who just constantly talks about the three T's. But those three T's are just so important to me. The first is technology. As you are looking at the holistic entirety of this, you say, what exists in the ecosystem already? What are the gaps? Do we buy, rent, or build? And so technology is always at the forefront. The second T, we're going back to that drawing board, is talent. Do I have the teams performing the roles or responsibilities in the best locations to support the program? And the last T, which is the one that keeps on changing, is transformation. And as you take a look at any point in time and ask yourself, what's the vision? I always think about three words: consolidate, validate, and iterate. And that can't happen without breaking down all of your workflows and your processes and determining, does the right work sit in the right place at the right time, and it's done in the right way by the right team. Lots of bright words there, but it's so important in the transformation journey, that you look at it holistically and make sure that you're mapping out that vision and executing in that structured way.
Streeter
It's a great way of looking at it. Steph, when you take Ben's T's into consideration, what kinds, what types of shifts should there be in policy and practice to, as Ben has been outlining, enhance agility and resilience to deal with future mobility changes ahead when it comes to talent, transformation, and technology?
King
Yeah, so agility and resilience will be absolutely critical in the face of future mobility changes. Organizations will likely need to shift policies and practises towards a more human-centric approach, and I think really drive greater flexibility in their policies that meet the needs of not just the business, the business success, but also the expectation of employees. We talked about it a little bit earlier that mobility isn't any longer just your traditional two to three-year expert assignment, and that's not what these mobility functions are, are just dealing with. It covers all aspects of global workforce management, be that short term business trips, remote working, commuting, and all of these require differing and more agile policies. With that, really, that's going to involve investing in workforce upskilling and improving workplace experiences, meeting the demands for these mobility experiences. And so the policies have got to align around those expectations.
Streeter
What lessons would you say, Steph, we've learned from the pandemic regarding just how quickly companies can adapt to new legal and tax environments?
King
I think it was really interesting for those of us that have been in mobility for a long time. I think we've always understood how critical mobility is for businesses, but also how complex it is and how many things need to be brought into consideration. It's not just tax, it's immigration and the right to work. It's a very complex area. I think what the pandemic did was it really highlighted this, and it gave mobility a seat at the table and really made organizations aware of some of the real risk and complexities with global workforce and people moving around. One of the first things that we saw with the pandemic really was that there were a lot of displaced people, so people who found themselves in jurisdictions where they were not employed. That created an initial review that needed to be undertaken. I think that really brought to the forefront the complexity associated with cross-border. I think it also highlighted the increased corporate exposure. Obviously, individuals can be impacted around mobility, but organizations can also be impacted from a PE (permanent establishment) perspective or payroll or any number of areas. But it doesn't just stop in terms of tax, immigration, social security complexities. Increasingly now, as we move into a new normal in a post-COVID world, things like cyber security, employment law, regulatory risks, all of these things are coming to the fore in terms of areas that organizations need to be thinking about when it comes to cross-border global workforce.
Willis
And Susannah sorry, if I can just jump in. It was that seat at the table was one thing, but that pandemic highlighted just how important the T of technology was. Having access to data, knowing where people were being able to record. It just brought that together and created this heightened reliance on technology.
Streeter
Certainly did. We all remember it so well, and it really is clear from past experiences that getting the right tech will provide solutions. But are companies ready for what's to come? Maureen, what does the EY Mobility Reimagined survey show in terms of the preparedness of companies to make investments into mobility technology over the next few years?
Flood
So, do I think people are ready? I think some are. Most are not quite there yet, still trying to figure it out. If we look at the survey data from a year ago, from 2023, 67% of organizations are planning on increasing their investments in technology to outmanage mobility. This year, it's up to 80%. The challenge now is really, what's the right platform? What's the right solution? How do I solve corporate mobility challenges but also maintain that focus on employee experience? As the technology is available and the ways that we engage with technology are shifting so quickly, we need to look at what do we have from an enterprise-wide perspective that we can leverage, what are employees responding to and engaging with. The conversations on how we deliver are very different than they were two or three years ago. I think they're very different than they're going to be two or three years from now. I think the pace of change around technology and how that drives how we deliver mobility, but also how we experience mobility, I think, is the real challenge for many organizations on really getting started on that journey or accelerating where they are on that path.
Streeter
Are there any good examples of companies who've done this well?
Flood
I think we've seen companies over the last, I'd really say 12 months, really look at what enterprise-wide solutions are their employees using to engage in doing their business day to day. And can I leverage those to share with them their mobility experiences? Can I leverage those to share data between my HRIS (human resources information systems) and my mobility vendors? How can I look at the current process and policy I have and use technology to enable that and streamline and create efficiencies without reinventing the wheel? I think that real starting point of what do I have today, what's working well, and how can I enhance that is really where we're seeing organizations drive the most success.
Streeter
And Steph, let me bring you back in. What are the transformative impacts have you seen so far in the use of such new technologies? What future advancements as well do you anticipate?
King
I would start out with saying, I think, two of the key areas for mobility at the moment and where technology has a huge impact are around managing costs and the employee experience, which we touched on a number of times. Huge focus for organizations in the world of mobility. I think technology, particularly automation and AI, have already had transformative impacts on mobility, much more around the delivery of mobility, simplifying processes, standardizing operations, etc, both for mobility functions in-house and for service providers like ourselves as well. From an employee experience perspective, individuals now, mobile workforces, their expectation is to have a consumer-grade experience. So the tools that they're interacting with when they're going on assignment, the tracking, the access to documents. There's so much going on for them that they expect to have everything really at hand in single portals with self-service digital tools. All of this is in play already and a lot more to come actually in terms of things that are being developed. A significant number of employers, 91%, believe that automation and digitization will bring benefits to mobility functions. Interestingly, though, a lesser number, only 27% have actually fully automated their mobility-related processes at this point.
Streeter
So the understanding is there, but a lot is still to be implemented. Ben, from your perspective, what are the best digital tools that could be employed to automate processes, which could enhance decision making, of course, as we've been hearing, and also improve compliance. I mean, are there any really good examples of how this is working in practise?
Willis
I think, Susannah, it's a good question, and I hate to answer a question with a question, but I think before you look at any specific digital tools, an organization has to satisfy themselves of some philosophical questions that help define their overarching vision. So first question I always put to clients is, what's your source of truth? Because that's the foundation. Is it internal in your HRIS or is it in the custody of a vendor? And ultimately, every organization needs to map out the ecosystem in which all of the tools live and breathe. There's no one tool that ticks all the boxes, so to speak. You have to think about where does your ATS (applicant tracking systems) or your HRIS and your finance systems or tools sit within that ecosystem? Then if you think in the mobility space with short term business travel and mobility tax and immigration, are there separate tools that you want to manage? Do you have ticketing tools, for want of a better word, or platforms that tie all these tools together with one user experience. Then there's more to think about. Reporting, automation capabilities, the ability to ingest data and export it in a production hub so that documents are produced automatically and bots can then launch. This overarching technology ecosystem is really complex. As I said, no one tool is the silver bullet that hits everything.
Streeter
Yeah, and I suppose that transparency is absolutely crucial. Steph, I mean, inevitably, the rise in remote work in hypermobile workforces has caught the eye of global tax authorities. How are they adapting the definitions of permanent establishment due to increased remote and hybrid working models? What impact do you think this is having in terms of risk when employees work across multiple jurisdictions?
King
I think we've really seen that awareness around hypermobile workforces come about post-pandemic, but reviews around permanent establishment were well underway prior to the pandemic. What the pandemic did actually do temporarily is actually lead to some relaxation in part around some legislation, as we discussed previously, where people became stranded in jurisdictions where they weren't employed. But we are now in this post-COVID world where hybrid and remote working is operated on a much more long-term basis. It's here to stay for sure. There is an understanding increasingly that some of these more flexible working models could possibly create a PE risk for businesses. Tax authorities have been adapting their definitions in response to the changing nature of the global economy and the increased mobility of businesses and also the rise of digital services. Just a few examples in terms of what has been happening. With BEPS, there are proposed changes to the definition of PE to prevent the artificial avoidance of PE status in relation to activities of multinational enterprises. We're seeing with the rise and the growth of the digital economy that tax authorities are considering how to tax businesses that have a significant digital presence in a country, but no physical presence as such. We're seeing countries modifying existing tax treaties so that they can update PE definitions in their treaties. We're also seeing businesses and tax authorities looking more closely at what constitutes a fixed place of business, which is quite interesting for individuals who are working from home, for example. For sure, tax authorities, they're continuing to adapt their approach to PE as business models evolve, and companies operating internationally or countries with these hypermobile workforces really need to stay on top and informed about the changes to ensure that they can maintain compliance with tax laws in all of the jurisdictions where they operate.
Streeter
So it seems absolutely crucial right now, given all that you're outlining, Steph. Ben, what's your take on this? How important then is it that there are platforms that are integrated so that more than one product can talk to another, essentially?
Willis
Yeah, if you take that PE issue that Steph was just talking about, the question is, how does corporate finance know if someone is traveling more frequently than they should and triggering that? It's back to the silver bullet and the answer is that you need visibility inside that ecosystem. You need a way that reporting can aggregate from a number of different data sources to ensure that all functions are looking at those risk elements. Again, there are ways to do that as long as within the ecosystem, there are bridges built between the platforms and tools.
Streeter
Maureen, what's your view on this? How else do you think companies can proactively manage these risks to avoid unexpected tax liabilities and also compliance issues?
Flood
I think one of the things that we see with some of the more evolved mobility functions is that they are engaging more with the business to understand where is the business going 6, 12, 18 months from now, three years from now. Where are we going to need people to grow our business based on the business growth objectives? They're aligning them with talent to figure out where is that talent going to come from. Based on where that talent is going to come from and what the business needs, how do we proactively think about what role mobility can play in identifying the right people, understanding the types of ways of working we're going to utilize those people to perform their roles in, and then be able to manage those risks really proactively thinking about what is coming on the forefront. What we see also is that those more evolved functions that are better connected with the business, better connected with talent, are having an exponential difference in the impact they're having on driving business resilience, managing the risk, driving talent, and retention. I think that a real proactive nature in getting involved with talent in the business to understand what the future is really allows those organizations to manage risks differently, and for those who aren't doing that today, it's really aspirational to not be as reactive as mobility has unfortunately had to be in the past.
Streeter
It is clear, isn't it, that mobility professionals do face real challenges and complexities. Aligning all these operations with all these diverse immigration labour and tax laws, Ben what challenges stand out the most for you here?
Willis
What stands out to me is looking at what companies are doing to address some of these challenges. I can think immediately of the story that comes to mind where the plant rang out of desperation for an immigration issue. They had one of their key critical staff member or employees who had returned to his home country in Asia to have his US visa renewed, was caught up in administrative processing, and they needed him back urgently and Christmas was coming, your typical exam question. We were able to jump in because our team in that particular country had the tax relationship. They were able to get a conversation going with the employee and that opened the door for our immigration team to then have a conversation with the employee and then with government authorities to, I want to say, free up the situation, resolve the immigration issue. The story then takes a turn because as the immigration issue is solved, it becomes apparent to the tax team that there is this financial tax consequence if the employee returns too early. The advice was to remain in the home country for a few more days to make sure this eliminated the personal and potential corporate tax liabilities. And so, that client walked away from that situation knowing that having this transparency and visibility and one service provider looking at both things in tandem became imperative. That's a change that they adopted quite quickly. The other story I've alluded to before, which was having the same scenario in the sense that the corporate finance people wanting to capture the business travel, which two separate functions typically within an organization, but bringing together that one service provider to be able to share risks from the business travel to the corporate finance group and through reporting and aggregating data, able to see where those risks are heightened.
Streeter
So, Maureen, what is your take on this? Just how crucial do you think this holistic approach is?
Flood
Susannah, before I get through that question, I just want to double-click on Ben's example and really talk about the integrated function and look at the risks from different angles. But I mentioned earlier how critical the employee experience is. Everything we do in mobility is centered around enabling business and talent. But the employees that we are moving around the world, be it for a week on a business trip, for months on a short term assignment, are at the heart of what we're really trying to drive in terms of their experience. Being detained while traveling is not super fun. Speaking from personal experience, I didn't read the fine print while on a business trip some years ago and ended up detained for a couple of days in airport jail. They did let me go to a hotel, but it derailed the rest of my trip. Candidly, it was a pretty horrifying experience in terms of just being scared because immigration police can be scary.
Streeter
That sounds like a whole new podcast, Maureen.
Flood
But I think it's important to remember that when we're not managing these risks proactively and having processes in place, we can create really challenging situations for our employees, potentially traveling with families and children. Let me tell you, it's been 15 years that I still tell that story all the time, and that's not what our clients that we're talking with want their mobile employees telling stories about. They want them telling stories about the amazing life-changing experiences that their assignments or business trips give them to connect with colleagues, to have incredible experiences to impact the business, to grow their families in different ways. The managing of risk is not just about the financial costs, the reputational risk, but it's really about what it means for the employees in their experience. To go back to your questions, how is this critical and thinking about a holistic approach? I think it's really important for mobility organizations to really understand the value and the impact that mobility can have on the business and on talent, on attracting, developing, and retaining talent, but also to really critically focus on the experiences of individuals. All of those things together are what really are allowing mobility functions to have just a really material impact on organizations and to get a seat at the table to really talk about the future of the organization and how mobility can help enable the business and talent. So I think it's a really exciting time for mobility, and there's never been a greater opportunity for mobility to ring the bell and get their seat at the table.
Streeter
How much is all of this going to change? I want to look ahead now and peer into our crystal balls and consider what the future holds. I just want your final thoughts. For anyone listening who wants to ensure their mobility models are not just fit for purpose today, but in the coming years, too. Maureen, what predictions can you make about how mobility functions are going to evolve over the next decade? What should we expect? What are your takeaways?
Flood
I think that the demands from employees around flexibility are here to stay, and organizations need to manage those and think about what that means in terms of the impact on the business and for their talent. I think more evolved mobility functions are going to continue to focus on looking at employee experience. They're going to look at integration with the business. Are we aligned or a talent strategy? How are we using technology to enable delivery? Really, what is the operating model? What does our ecosystem of mobility look like to really drive forward a better experience in a more streamlined fashion. I think keeping employees at the centre of all that remains critical. But I think now really is the time for organizations to really look at where they are, draw a line in the sand, and start to transform mobility to really be more evolved and have a more strategic impact on the future of business and talent.
Streeter
Maureen, thank you. Steph, from you, what strategies do you think need to be in place to ensure teams are nimble enough to move not just with current, but also new emerging trends?
King
Probably a few areas to touch on. Mobility teams would be no different to lots of other teams out there in terms of some of the strategies they will need to embrace. I would say continuous learning, so encouraging ongoing training and education, keeping skills up to date as mobility advances and the industry advances. I think adopting agile practises, which we talked about quite early on, allowing for quick adaption and iterative development to allow them to respond to changing trends. We talked about using data, so adopting data-driven decision-making, I think it's going to be really important. Technology adoption will be absolutely critical. Just a continued embracing of risk management and implementing robust risk management frameworks so that they can evaluate and mitigate any potential impacts of any new trends.
Streeter
Okay, thank you, Steph. Ben, how should organizations future proof their mobility strategy strategies against all these anticipated changes in tax and immigration law that we've been outlining?
Willis
Susannah, we know one thing, and that is that immigration laws are extremely dynamic. They never stay the same. Staying abreast of these changing immigration laws, practices, and policies across key locations will always be a challenge. It's important to go back to thinking about technology to track and report using the data to identify key patterns in business movement. Then from a service delivery perspective, building a scalable model using subject matter experts to gain knowledge and insight and can go to support organizations as they future-proof these changing immigration laws.
Streeter
Okay, well, thank you to all three of you for your time. It really has been fascinating delving into what the future will hold as well as all the challenges and opportunities we see right now. But before we go, a quick note from the legal team. The views of third parties set out in this podcast are not necessarily the views of the global EY organization or its member firms. Moreover, they should be seen in the context of the time in which they were made. I'm Susannah Streeter. I hope you'll join me again for the next edition of the Tax and Law in Focus podcast, EY: Shaping the Future with Confidence.